Topic: Logan's Reward - CB500 and CB550 Cafe Projects

[Restoration Fan]

Aren't these also the connector blocks that often have melted connector bodies because of increased resistance/heat before total failure? They often need replacement,  so I would do as Cal suggested.
Also,  I see 7 , not 6 wires.
David

David,
Thank you; I really do appreciate the response and you guys looking over this stuff to make sure I'm not messing up something.

Regarding the wires, the 500 diagram shows 7 wires.
B/R - which goes to the oil pressure switch
LG/R - goes to the neutral switch
then the G, W, and Y, Y, Y



Ron

[Restoration Fan]

So I'm making a bit of progress but still have a little ways to go.
I got the PDM60 mounted, hooked up and functioning.  I have to say that I'm really impressed with the simplicity of installing and setting up this device.  I still have to take the time to program it for instant start-up because it currently has a 7-second delay.  I can also set the amp limit for each circuit but I'm going to wait & do that after I get everything hooked up.  But I only had a little while to work on the wiring today. (I did also install a grounding block in the headlight bucket though.  It's grounded to the headlight bucket bolt and then has 6 lugs.  Off of each of these, I ran a green grounding wire connected to the 3-plug connector that will let me plug in 3 bullet connectors to ground 3 items.

I spent more time getting the rear wheel, chain, sprocket, brake and everything on the rear of the bike installed.  Also installed a new front sprocket and installed a new clutch cable, steel ball and buttoned up the clutch.  I still have to do some clutch adjustment though.

I changed the oil and oil filter and got the headers ready for mounting.  I would have already mounted the pipes but I'm going to have to re-organize everything in the shop it appears so that I can find the stash of round, copper washers that install in front of the headers.  I have like 8 of them but can't find any of them at the moment.

And finally, I spent quite a bit of time testing and finding the best 2 coils to use and getting them installed onto the bike.  Now I just need to finish the wiring of the circuits over the next day or two and I should be ready to start this thing.  I still have to make the seat but I didn't like the initial prototype I made so I'm going to have to make another one until I do like it...then I'll fiberglass it, paint it and sand it.  I also have to add the panel underneath the seat hump area to hold the battery permanently.  I've just had it sitting in the tray with the PDM60 and connected loosely for testing.

Oh yeah, I have to say that I LOVE how light this bike is compared to Stella. I really can't wait until I get the 550 put together to ride; it should be a lot of fun.

[Restoration Fan]

Does someone have a link to a master cylinder rebuild kit?  I didn't have to buy the one for Stella from online because Bill Benton had one and I just bought it from him.  But I'm going to need to rebuild the master cylinder for this 500.

[mark52]

Hey Ron, not sure if you already got one but I have a new MC rebuild kit that I didn't use on my bike (seems I bought more than one for some reason???).  Not sure if it will work for the 500 but if you want to give it a try let me know and I will send it your way. The bike is looking good so far.

Mark

[Restoration Fan]

Hey Ron, not sure if you already got one but I have a new MC rebuild kit that I didn't use on my bike (seems I bought more than one for some reason???).  Not sure if it will work for the 500 but if you want to give it a try let me know and I will send it your way. The bike is looking good so far.

Mark

Mark,
I didn't find one yet.  The master cylinder appears to be the exact same as the 750, so if you do still have that one, I'll gladly take it.
In case you don't still have my mailing address, I'll PM it to you.  Also, if you'll let me know how much it is, I'll gladly pay for it and the shipping.

By the way, when are you coming back up this way?  I wanna hear that 750 of yours purring.

Ron

[Stev-o]

Hey Ron....many of us wont bother rebuilding a master cylinder since DSS started offering this aftermarket one...

https://www.davidsilverspares.com/CB550F1-SUPER-SPORT-1976/part_123900/

Unless you are doing a 100 point restore, cant beat the quality for the price.

[Restoration Fan]

Wow.  That's awesome.  Thank you.

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

That's a pretty nice option for those going the resto-route.

[Restoration Fan]

I bought a set of 550 carbs from Bill Benton a while back and he sold them to me at a discount because one of the posts that holds the float bowl pins had broken off when he dropped it.  So today, I drove the set of carbs over to Jim French's workshop in Dacula, GA.  He has a micro welding business and does absolutely incredible work.  Not only that, he's one heck of a nice guy and a pleasure to be around.  I had a great time looking at all of his equipment and asking stupid questions that he patiently answered.  His carb welding service is listed in the Services Offered section under classifieds on this site.  He only charges $25 for welding the post as well.  I can't recommend his services highly enough.
You really do meet the nicest people working on a Honda.

So now that I have that part working, I'm trying to remove the float bowl pins from one of my other 2 sets of carbs.  The manual says to "pull the pin" but when I grip it with needle nose pliers or needle nose vice grips, it doesn't want to come out.  I've also tried heating it a bit and finally tapping it with a small center punch but I didn't hit it hard for fear of breaking another post (although that would be another good excuse to go over and see Jim again.).  Is there a better technique for getting these things out?

[70CB750]

Did you try to soak it first?

[RAFster122s]

A good penetration oil like Kroil, PB Blaster, and other high quality penetration oil can help along with a well placed tap with a blunt striker. I think they come out one way but it has been a while.  Then again mine might be that way because of a PO.
a magnifying glass and bright light might reveal more clues.
Heating them up and then a spray of cold liquid can cause them to break free or to plain break.
canned air upside down will give you a shot of refrigerant.  I would do that last.
I would heat them up real hot thdn hit thdm with penetration oil a couple times and see if it working them loose.
Worse case you go visit Jim again and he re builds the posts. You will have them cleaned up and they won't have the problem again. In use the carbs don't corrode, left to dry out they usually cause the mose problems.  Unless you run ethanol fuel.  I like to use a little bit of SeaFoam Motor Treatment.  It seems to keep things working well and helps my VB series CV series carbs on the CX500 be much happier than without it. The CV carbs can have a bad rep, but since I cleaned and feed them good fuel with Seafoam regularly they were much improved and trouble free.

[mashfu]

really like the route you're going, STICKING AROUND FOR THIS!

[Restoration Fan]

Since I've finally gotten some time recently to work on the 500, I thought I'd post an update on it.
First thing, I purchased a really cool tool called the Astra Pneumatic tool for nut/thread hand rivets.  Some people call them "nutserts".  Essentially, you drill the proper sized hole, put the correct threaded insert onto the tool and use the tool to pop the threaded rivet into place.  At that point, you have a threaded hole you can screw into.  Here's a link for the tool in case anyone is interested:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003TODXQW/?tag=googhydr-20&hvadid=43821491916&hvpos=1t1&hvexid=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=87949921355256696&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=b&hvdev=c&ref=pd_sl_4spfufkslj_b


I used it on the 500 because I wanted to be able to put down a piece of sheet metal to hold the battery and some other electrical components that aren't going in the electronics tray...but I want to leave this bike with the ability to go back to a fairly stock look in case the person who buys it wants to do so.  By using these rivets, they can just unscrew the plate and could go back to a stock battery tray and stock seat if they want to...because I didn't cut the frame to weld in a hoop on this one like I will on the 550.

[Restoration Fan]

Next, I started working on the wiring with the PDM 60.  I really, really like this device.  Very good quality and the people at Rowe Electronics are super friendly and helpful.



Mike and I went through a couple of iterations on the wiring diagram and ended up with different layers for every circuit in the system.  That way, we were able to print out one overall circuit, plus one per every single circuit in the system, which makes the wiring really simple because you can look at, wire, and test just that one circuit.  I have the circuit wired that activates the PDM60, plus 3 of the 5 circuits and those are all working properly.  Tomorrow, I'm going to try & finish the wiring of the other 2 circuits, plus changing over the plug on the regulator/rectifier so that it matches the one coming from the stator.

[Zaipai]

Next, I started working on the wiring with the PDM 60.  I really, really like this device.  Very good quality and the people at Rowe Electronics are super friendly and helpful.

My sound silly but what does this do?

Thanks,
.: Scott :.

[Restoration Fan]

While all that was going on, I took the carbs over to Jim French and he micro-welded the one broken float pin holder tower for me.  After that, I gave the needles and jets a thorough bath in the Berryman's carb dip and finished cleaning all of those up.  They're in the process of reassembly right now and I expect to mount them to the bike within the next few days.

The new Shinko tires (yes, I went cheap since this is a flip) are on and the brake caliper has been cleaned and reassembled.  Now, I just have to mount that onto the bike but I'm waiting to do that when I put the front fender on.  That has been chopped and had one coat of paint on it but I didn't like the few small nicks that were visible in it so I stripped that back down and I'm in the process of filling those with Bondo and sanding to prep it for final primer & paint.  The tank has also been stripped back down and had multiple skim coats of Bondo on it and now passes the "blind feel" inspection test so I'm going to put a coat of primer on that as well as soon as it's warm enough outside for the paint to cure.  The weather forecasts are calling for highs in the low to mid 70's by the end of the week next week (Christmas) so I'll hopefully get a chance to get all the body paint done.

I've made the seat mold for the seat and applied the first coat of fiberglass onto it.  MY GOD does that stuff stink.  It made the entire house smell for 3 days and I have a really big house so my family was not at all happy with me.  Since Kelli is now home, I'll wait until she's out of the house for a few days because I can only imagine what it would do to her asthma when I do more of this fiberglass stuff.  I'm not a big fan of the squared off cafe humps but I did that for this one because I was able to fit it over the vertical pieces of the seat hump...again meaning I can go back to the stock seat if the next owner chooses to do so.  But I'd like to get that finished, dried, sanded and painted so that I can do the paint for the tank, front fender and seat all at one time.  Hopefully, the weather will cooperate between now and New Year's as I plan to take most of that time off from work.

[Restoration Fan]

Scott,
Not a silly question at all.  This is going to replace the fuse box on the 500.  It provides an electronically fused system with up to 6 different circuits.  In my case, I'm only going to use 5 circuits and leave a 6th wired up into the bucket and capped off for future expansion if ever needed.

Rather than blow a fuse, this gives you a green LED light when the system fires up.  If you have an electrical short, the LED goes to red while the fault is occurring and then to amber afterwards to denote that there was a problem on the circuit.  Instead of having to stop & replace a fuse though, you just turn off the bike and turn it back on and that circuit is reset.

Each circuit is programmable as to how many amps you want on that circuit and has programmable delays on it as well.  The system is really designed to be used with newer bikes and has been used almost exclusively to add accessories onto those.  You wire your accessories into this PDM60 and configure the circuits as you need them.  But I came across this on the web and thought it would work for me as a control module for the entire bike.  I called the people at Rowe Electronics and they said that, while it has never been used that way (to their knowledge), it should absolutely fit the purpose I would be using it for.  Their engineer even confirmed that the entire system is fused...which I wanted to know because I didn't want to have to put a fuse in between the battery and the PDM60...since that would defeat the whole reason I was putting it on the bike.

Ron

[Restoration Fan]

Anyway, here's the PDM60 as I started wiring it and here's a shot of it with the tail light now mounted and working:



Something else that has taken me a while is that my metal fabrication skills are very minimal.  I have just purchased a MIG welder and I'm learning to weld but I haven't tried to weld anything on the bike yet.  But just using some basic cutting & bending skills, I made the electronics seat pan, a bracket to hold the rear tail light and a small bracket to mount the ignition key switch.  It's turning out to be a lot of fun to mess with that stuff.

[Restoration Fan]

The biggest technical hurdles yet to overcome now are shortening the clutch cable and mounting the rearsets and hooking them up.  I had said I wasn't going to put rear sets on this bike but I found a set that was reasonably inexpensive and ordered those from eBay.  They're on their way from Vietnam right now...literally on a slow boat from China, I suppose.  Once they arrive, I'll put them on and then start finishing up the controls of the bike.

If all goes as planned, I expect to have it running and rideable by New Year's day.  *cross fingers*

[Zaipai]

Thanks for all the info on the PDM60 it was very detailed and I will look into that my fuse box is a real mess and this sounds like a great answer to it rather than trying to retro fit a newer blade style fuse box.

Loving your build so far. 

.: Scott :.

[Restoration Fan]

Thanks for all the info on the PDM60 it was very detailed and I will look into that my fuse box is a real mess and this sounds like a great answer to it rather than trying to retro fit a newer blade style fuse box.

Loving your build so far. 

.: Scott :.

My pleasure.  If you do decide to go the PDM60 route, shoot me a PM and I'll gladly send you an electronic copy of the most recent wiring diagram we're using, as well as the individual layers.  It does make the wiring much simpler.

You should know however that the m-Unit is also favored by many here.  It does everything the PDM60 does and more.  For instance, you still need a winker/flasher diode with the PDM60 whereas that is built into the m-Unit.  The mUnit is a bit pricier but I do intend to buy one for the 550 build when it gets started.

[Restoration Fan]

One final update for today but this one is on the 550. 
The steering conversion bearings I got from All Balls are the wrong size.  The ones they show as working for putting a CBR1000RR front end on a CB550 frame are much too small on the interior diameter for the top and the bottom.  The top is 5mm too small and the bottom one is 6mm too small to fit over the stem of the CBR1000RR.  I intend to call All Balls on Monday with the dimensions to hopefully get the proper bearing sets to me so I can get a roller on that frame. 

That way, I can mount the front end, then mount the rear tire using both the stock 550 swing arm and the swing arm from the CBR600RR that I have.  I can then use my measurements versus the stock measurements (obtained from the 500) to determine the effect on rake/trail/swing arm angle, and swing arm length. 

For those who are interested, I purchased an eBook that is pretty fantastic.  I'm not allowed to include the whole thing (and honestly, I'd have to make a screenshot of every page to do so) but here are the pages from the chapter on how rake/trail, etc effect steering geometry.  I happen to really enjoy this kind of stuff so I guess I'm admitting how much of a nerd I am. 

This is the book.  I happen to think it's worth every penny of the $13 or so that I paid for it:


Here's the stuff from the chapter I mentioned:

[Retro Rocket]

  For those who are interested, I purchased an eBook that is pretty fantastic.  I'm not allowed to include the whole thing (and honestly, I'd have to make a screenshot of every page to do so) but here are the pages from the chapter on how rake/trail, etc effect steering geometry.  I happen to really enjoy this kind of stuff so I guess I'm admitting how much of a nerd I am. 

This is the book.  I happen to think it's worth every penny of the $13 or so that I paid for it:


Here's the stuff from the chapter I mentioned:

Nothing nerdy about that kind of info Ron, I wish a few more people understood it.... I've been into suspensions for as very long time, I have a mate thats a bit of a "nerd" {expert} too...

[Restoration Fan]

Nothing nerdy about that kind of info Ron, I wish a few more people understood it.... I've been into suspensions for as very long time, I have a mate thats a bit of a "nerd" {expert} too...

Ha!  Yes, I'm aware.  It was your insistence that using the longer swingarm from the CBR was going to affect handling that prodded me into doing some research on the matter and eventually led to the purchase of this book.  So, I thank you for the heads up because I have already learned some really interesting facts.  FWIW, there are a couple of chapters in that book on shocks alone.  I learned way more about shocks than I ever imagined.

Ron

[Retro Rocket]

Nothing nerdy about that kind of info Ron, I wish a few more people understood it.... I've been into suspensions for as very long time, I have a mate thats a bit of a "nerd" {expert} too...

Ha!  Yes, I'm aware.  It was your insistence that using the longer swingarm from the CBR was going to affect handling that prodded me into doing some research on the matter and eventually led to the purchase of this book.  So, I thank you for the heads up because I have already learned some really interesting facts.  FWIW, there are a couple of chapters in that book on shocks alone.  I learned way more about shocks than I ever imagined.

Ron

Knowledge is power my friend....