Topic: Help with starting gremlins

[dpearce]

1976 CB550...I know this topic gets beat to death, but maybe someone can get me pointed in the right direction.
When I first bought the bike a few months ago, the start button worked fine, however battery was old and week so I just kick-started.  After I removed the right hand control to swap bars, the old pushbutton crumbled into a hundred little pieces.  Bought new Honda right hand switch (ouch), and bought a new, fully charged battery.  Now all I get is the solenoid click clicking.  12V to the battery side, but only 4V (+/-) on the starter side when the button is pushed.  My first thought was a bad solenoid, however when I bridge the two posts with a screw driver, I still get no starter spin.  I have began cleaning all the connections to make sure everything is tight and shiny, but since the new right hand switch is the only thing I really changed, I'm wondering if that could be part of the problem.  If I get the click, click, doesn't that mean it's grounding properly and doing it job (??). 

Any help would with a testing sequence would be appreciated.  I'm half-way literate with a meter and can read a wiring diagram.   

Thanks

[540nova]

Some handlebar switches require a ground to the bar itself thus you need a clean shiny place where the switch rests. I would look into that for starters, no pun intended.


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[dpearce]

Yeah, I wondered about that.  All the connectors/wire colors matched the stock, so I plugged & played.  Worth a shot- I'll try sanding the paint off the new bars.
I figured that if the switch makes the solenoid click, it is grounding properly and all is good...

[dpearce]

Thanks, everything looks stock, but I will take all the connections off and re-clean/tighten.  Just ordered a new solenoid, will try that too.  Looks like I have to remove the side cover to get to the actual starter motor on a 76?  Took the access cover off, but the feed wire is not visible.

[dpearce]

Yes, the wire from the solenoid to the starter.  I'll try the jumper.  I was hoping to get to the post on the starter itself to try jumping as well, but the top panel cover doesn't allow access to the POS wire best I can see.  Removing the shift cover that big a deal?

[dpearce]

No, the starter wire has not been touched.  Only swapped out batteries.  I meant that I would like to test that wire, but cannot get to the connection on the actual starter, due to the shift cover.  I can only test it at the solenoid post. 
I'll get that cover off tonight and check it out.

[dpearce]

Will do, thanks.  Hopefully just the solenoid.

[Vinhead1957]

After you jumped the big terminals on the solenoid and the starter didn't turn, it proves the problem is the starter motor.

[dpearce]

Ohmed out the negative battery cable to double check it doesn't have a break, sanded/cleaned all surfaces bright and shiny, reattached.  Voltage at the new battery sitting cold is 12.83V.  As soon as I can manage the side cover off, I will run a jumper straight to the starter, and test that feed wire as well.  New solenoid valve arrived today.  Cheap, so I will probably just swap that out for good measurel.
Aggravating.

[dpearce]

Ok, an update...sorta.  I now have a new solenoid & rebuilt starter to go along with my new battery and new right-hand controls.  Starter will now engage with the pushbutton, but doesn't seem to have enough juice to make it spin enough to start.  Struggles.  I can hook up an external car battery (using a separate ground to the frame) with much higher cranking power, and it works perfectly.
I've tested everything I know to test, but I keep thinking there is a grounding issue.  Even though the main battery cables ohm out ok, and my connections are clean and tight, is there value in just replacing those as well?  Is there any way that the starter motor somehow isn't grounding properly internally?

Thanks

[dpearce]

I'll check those voltages tonight.  It very well may be the battery, or a combination of the two.  I opted for a cheapo Exide brand.  This bike's charging system actually works well, and I prefer kick starting most of the time, so I didn't think I needed a super great battery.  I'll pull it off and get it tested as well.

[madmtnmotors]

And if that doesn't work you can always try one of these:

http://www.gremlinbells.com/

[dpearce]

I'll look into that gremlin bell...haha

I was sure it wasn't the starter, but after tested a little more, I noticed the starter wire heating up more than it should.  Bench tested again, and experienced more of the same overheating.  Something wrong possibly causing excessive resistance.  I'm dropping it off today to a local starter shop to get more info.  Hope it can be repaired, b/c wow they are pricey...

I'll definitely look into a better battery as well.  Like I said, I will be kick starting more than not, so I grabbed that cheap Exide thinking it would be fine.   

[dpearce]

Ok, unlikely solution found....took the starter to a shop, he thought that by the sound it was making, it was the little bronze bushing going bad.  That was the only thing I didn't replace from the rebuild kit, b/c I'm really not sure how you get it out. Got it back today with the new bushing, stuck it back on the bike, starts like brand new! 
Lesson learned, even though the bushing looked fine, go ahead and have it replaced regardless.
One less gremlin...